Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Opinions expressed in this episode are personal. They do not necessarily reflect the views.
[00:00:05] Speaker B: Of this streaming platform.
Good day, everyone, and welcome to another edition of let's Be Diverse. I am your host, Andrew Stout. This episode is dedicated to all my loved ones who supported me through this journey.
Something that I was reading about this weekend is talking about managing up. So I thought I would have a chat about this. So today we're going to be talking about managing up. And my guest today is Laura Lily Goodrich. Welcome to the show, Laura. We are so happy and pleased to have you on here today.
[00:00:43] Speaker A: Thank you. I'm really grateful to be here. This is a topic that I love to dive into. So I'm excited to get going with you today.
[00:00:52] Speaker B: That is super awesome. Tell us about you. What's going on with you? What's going on in your world? Give us the deets. What, what's happening in your world?
[00:01:01] Speaker A: Yeah, so it's been, it's been busy. I, this week has been a lot of in person stuff, so I usually work from home, which is, which is wonderful. I do a lot of online work. However, this week has been very heavily in person, which has been a really nice welcome change. Really nice to spend time in people, people's energy and to talk about certain topics that they've been struggling with, whether it's coaching or whether it's companies that are looking to build their management team. So it's been a really nice change to be out of the house, a little bit more downtown in Toronto, enjoying the energy down there, but also coming back and spending as much time with my dog as I can.
[00:01:45] Speaker B: Yeah, no kidding. No kidding. Yeah, it's nice to kind of get out and have conversations with people and be sociable sometimes. Right? It's super, super cool to do that. Well, I'm glad to hear that things are going well and that business is going well and you're busy. It's, you know, there's a lot of people out there that are not busy. So it's nice to hear that things are going well for you. Thanks for. Thanks for sharing. Before we begin to get in the nuts and bolts of our conversation here, I always have a fun, thought provoking question for my guests to get things going. Are you ready for yours today?
[00:02:20] Speaker A: I am. I have no idea what this is going to be, so you're going to get a raw answer.
[00:02:28] Speaker B: So my question to you is, if someone told you he was a chronic liar, would you believe him?
Oh, or her?
[00:02:43] Speaker A: Would I believe them? If they're a chronic liar, then they're probably lying.
Would they tell the truth about their.
Would they tell a. Would, would a liar tell the truth about them being a liar?
Probably not.
[00:03:07] Speaker B: So that's. It sounds like a big fat no there.
[00:03:10] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:14] Speaker B: I don't know if I would either. I think if they were just, they were coming out saying that, I think I'd be like, I kind of be a little bit iffy on that as well.
[00:03:22] Speaker A: Yeah, it would definitely make me question a lot, I think at the time. But I, my question would be, would I. Would a liar really tell you the truth about being a liar?
[00:03:35] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I would kind of wonder. I'd wonder about that for sure. For sure. Well, listen, you did great. Thanks so much for having fun with me. I just love those questions. I think I kind of like them a little bit more sometimes than the guest just because I know what's coming, the guest doesn't. And I just look forward to seeing what kind of answers that they come up with. So I appreciate, I appreciate your fun. I appreciate you having fun with me. Why don't we start off with you telling us a little bit about you, your story and of course your why.
[00:04:08] Speaker A: Yeah. So I'm Laura Lilly. I have a long standing background in HR professionally nearly a year ago, so I'm 11 months in at the moment. I switched my career from a head of HR role into running my own business. So I now have a private consulting company that I offer one on one coaching as well as workshops and facilitation for first time and middle managers. I focus a lot on first time and middle managers, usually up to VP level purely because I don't think there's enough support out there for that cross section of individuals. And it was something that I really noticed throughout my career in hr. The managers of a company tend to hold a lot of the weight of performance because they managed the entirety of the company. And so it's a, it's an, it's a cross section of people that I feel aren't always best served internally. And so I wanted to dedicate my work to enabling that crowd, really getting them into a place where they feel confident to really own performance, retention, drive results.
And I took that pivot on the basis that I genuinely think managers want to do a good job. They just don't always have the tools or the coaching or the support in order to do that. So that's my why when it comes to my business. And personally, I am a huge fan of animals. I have my own dog who I love. I'm British born. I moved to Canada in 2018, been here ever since. It was a, a whimsical move, I will say, and one with no real plan intended to be a two year stay. But I've been here nearly six years later so I would say maybe a bit adventurous in that regard. I'm always looking to develop myself personally as well. So I'm a big advocate for self development, self awareness, self improvement as well. Tell us a little bit about me.
[00:06:19] Speaker B: I love all of that. There's so many things that I want to pack into. First of all, I, I love the fact that you kind of adapted or figured out, you know, or changed your thought process. Some people are kind of afraid to kind of dabble into different things because they're, they don't think that they have the qualifications or they don't have the confidence to do so. So kudos to you for doing that. The second thing I want to dabble in which kind of interests me or piqued my interest was you talking about middle management.
And I do see that as well that a lot of middle management don't have the training to when they first start.
I'm kind of thinking it's kind of like a two fold type thing. I'd be curious to hear what your thoughts are. But you know, I think it's a two fold thing where I think that a lot of people kind of take that job and I'm sure we'll get into a little bit further as we go on, but a lot of people take that management job because it's like a pay bump. But they're not as far as realizing what they're taking on. They don't really know and it's just, they're just there for the pay bump. But it's also, it's theirs. I think it's their responsibility to make sure that they have everything or the tools that they need to be successful. But I also think it's a company's job to make sure that when they're putting those people in place that they're not put on an island with no food, water or shelter and that they, you know, that they're taught how to do the right things because it's just going to better be better for the organization overall.
[00:08:02] Speaker A: Yeah, and I agree. And it's, it's twofold really. It's, it's kind of, we can all point blame who should be doing what and I think if managers themselves felt more empowered, they would ask for more. I think if companies set up the transition into management much better, clearer and more defined. We would all be in a better position too. So I do think it's twofold. I don't think it's one individual or company that owns full responsibility. I do feel like both parties are accountable for the success of this role. I genuinely feel that often managers are put into roles or they accept roles, whichever way you want to look at it, that they don't necessarily have a true understanding of what it is.
There has been a reduction in, I would say like high performing individuals going into manager roles because I think companies are seeing that that's not always the best transition. Neither do those high performing individuals want to then stay in those roles because they then become not so high performing, which is a knock to the ego. And it might be that that's what they needed to realize that they wanted to stay where they were. And so I don't think neither one is better nor worse than the other. I do think it's a combined thing. But it, I do feel it's the company's responsibility to provide an environment as best they can. And that's truly as best they can in order to create this transition or in order for this transition to turn into something that they actually want, which is success.
[00:09:48] Speaker B: Spoken like a true HR individual. You gave both sides, which is usually what I do when someone throws something at me. I kind of do exactly what you did. Well, this is what I think on this side, but this is what I think on this side. And if we meet in the middle here, this is where this is what will happen. So I loved your answer. For people who out there who want to know exactly how HR people think, that is exactly how Laura explained that is exactly how we think.
[00:10:18] Speaker A: Yeah. And I, I also think that that's a personal thing because I everything in my, in my life, you know, I don't get me wrong, I have not done this my entire life. But in recent years I've really started to notice point the blame outside of myself for sure. And once you start doing that, and I've seen it through my one on one clients, you know, if you're of the fruition that, you know, no one's necessarily coming to save you, if you're focused on yourself and building yourself, then you have the opportunity to change your surroundings. Be it that, you know, you can't change everything. Everybody has responsibilities and everybody sometimes has to just do what they need to do to get things done or to, you know, quote unquote survive in many ways. But there are ways to change your own situation.
And sometimes it's really about looking about how you are helping yourself as best as you can. And again, that's very much situational.
That's a situational thing. But the focus is, you know, you can only really ask yourself, what is it that I can do in this situation to, to better it?
[00:11:30] Speaker B: For sure, absolutely. So, so listen, we're. Today we're talking about managing up.
What does it mean to manage up, Laura?
[00:11:40] Speaker A: So I have a slightly different view on managing up. I think managing up is a phrase that's been coined, but essentially it's, it's a communication process by which individuals create boundaries, they set expectations and they ask questions to essentially drive action as well as understanding not just about the situation, but also about the other person. And so it's consciously managing the delivery of the information you're giving and requesting from the other person for a greater outcome. And so I tend to use an acronym which is like the three Cs, which is communication plus comprehension equals cohesion. And managing up essentially is all about driving cohesion between people.
[00:12:37] Speaker B: I love when you're saying communication because. Absolutely. I think it is key. And I feel like we don't communicate enough. I feel like we can. Some people are afraid to communicate so much and I don't think that there's, I don't think, I mean, I'd rather you over communicate rather than to not communicate. And, and, and I think it's super important. I feel like your team underneath you will definitely appreciate you being, communicating things more. And there's always a way to do it and there's always a way around certain things as well. But we just don't want to be left in the dark or employees don't want to be left in the dark.
[00:13:17] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And as I said, like, managing up isn't just about managing, you know, up to your manager, their manager, etc. It's really about the way in which you're communicating. Managing up could be a peer, could be how you're managing your team, how you're managing cross. Functionally. Functionally. It's essentially the way in which you, you're consciously choosing to communicate.
[00:13:46] Speaker B: So how do we practice managing up, or how does a manager or leader practice managing up?
[00:13:54] Speaker A: Yeah, it's certainly something that takes a lot of practice. And I don't mean that you repeat the same thing over and over again and learn it off by heart. It really is an approach.
And to start with, I would always say the best thing about managing up is to find out what the other person's style is their communication style. So you know, how do they work? How best do they receive information or feedback? Is it written, spoken? What time is best for them? Morning, afternoon, what setting is it? One on one, do they mind being spoken to at their desk or on Zoom or on any kind of like instant message, like Slack or Google Chat or whatever?
But really, like, how best can you communicate with them? And also like, what are their, like, priorities? What are they focusing on? What information are they gonna, are they gonna need?
Because think, you got to think about what's important to them, what's going to keep their attention, what's going to keep their interest in what you're saying.
Because they need to also know, like how your information that you're providing is going to impact them. Right? Like what, how is it relevant? We've all been in meetings or we've all had conversations, particularly at work where we're just like, you know, this could have been sent on an email or I'm not really needed in this room. And so you want to make sure that what you're saying is relevant to them. But I would also lean into observation. So like really observing, how about how they go about doing their role? Like, what is it that, what is it that they're showing you that's important to them? What's important to their role and their goal?
Because that will enable you to like, share wisely and not just like share out of panic because you're trying to force information that you think they need to hear. You want to give them information that they need to hear, even if they don't know they need to hear it yet. You've got to deliver it in a way that they're actually going to understand it. And I had a really big aha moment in my career where one of my former managers, he was the cfo and I was talking to him once and he just looked me dead in the face and he said, laura, if you keep communicating to me in a way that I don't understand, I won't be able to approve this for you.
And I just was blown back. Like, we had a very good working relationship and I just thought, oh my goodness, I have been talking HR to a finance person instead of talking financial HR to a finance person.
And it was really eye opening for me and that caused me to then say that, okay, what do they need? How do they work? Am I getting the right timing? Am I optimizing the opportunity in order to deliver the message that I need to deliver?
[00:16:56] Speaker B: I was so excited when you said observing their role, because a lot of people are afraid to have someone watch them or they don't like to have somebody standing over them watching them while they're working or observing what they're doing because they kind of take it as a. Almost like, as a negative saying that, oh, I'm being watched because I wanna.
And it might be a case in those cases where they're trying, but they're trying to help. But if you're. They're observing, in other words, it's. If they don't know what's going on, they can't help you. So by observing and seeing what you're doing, they're gonna be able to give you some proper feedback or maybe some ideas or something that you've never even thought of that will make your job a lot easier. So I, I was excited when you said that. And I also love when you said engaged. I, I think that it's so important for us to keep ourselves engaged. I mean, I was just talking before, when, just before we started taping, and I said that I don't like to have my podcast off for a certain long time because then I lose the engagement or I find that I lose the engagement of. Engagement of my audience. And I, you know, if you're gonna do that in a, In a work setting or, you know, in a company setting, there is a good chance that you could lose their engagement. And that's one of the things that we don't want.
[00:18:30] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, you say we're managing up to our manager. They have different priorities than you do, and that's just the way that it is. And that's absolutely fine. And they should. They, you know, they're not doing your job. They should have different priorities. You. And so understanding how your knowledge can impact them and being able to talk about that, I think is a game changer. But you're only going to learn how to do that by really understanding what it is that they do, what information that they need from you that's helpful and starting to really do what you can. As I said in the beginning, do what you can to help influence the situation. And that might be taking a look at your own approach.
[00:19:14] Speaker B: So I'm going to ask you something interesting here, Laura. Is it better to manage up or manage down?
[00:19:20] Speaker A: I would say in terms of better. I would say these principles push for better communication, period.
I don't feel that anybody would not benefit from really understanding the person's priorities of whomever they are communicating with, whether It's a peer. Whether it's your team, whether it's like a team that you manage or your manager or the C suite, someone at the C suite level, it can be applied to anybody.
And managing up, as I said, isn't just you reporting to your manager, it's reporting to everyone. There's a lot of empathy in managing upwards, which is why people find it difficult and people associate it with a scary thing. Because you're learning, actually, you're learning something much bigger than you think it is. You think it's just communicating with your boss, but it's communication period, in my opinion. And so you're not taught how to do that until you hit management. You're just more aware of it. And so you know, you're not taught how to listen, you're not taught how to sit and just be while someone is talking to you and observing and taking on information.
You're not taught how to ask questions that seek information. You're just told how to solve problems.
And also like, you're not taught how to deal with not knowing the answer and being okay with it. And so do I think it's better up or down? I would say I don't think it's. I don't think one is better than the other. They're both, they're both exceptionally good examples of why learning how to manage up, period, could be, could have such a wide impact on the way in which you communicate with anybody.
[00:21:16] Speaker B: So you mentioned communication and again, we talk about it before and I, I think it's super important. Do you think that managers have trouble with this? Like, are you seeing a lot of managers having trouble managing up because they, they have trouble communicating?
[00:21:33] Speaker A: Yeah, they go, they go really hand in hand. And I think becoming a manager is tricky when it comes to communication and I think it's for a couple of reasons. One is because there is an onus to be correct.
You're a manager, you should know, and it's a phrase all the time. You should know better. But when you're a new manager, you don't. Right. Like I'd say the transition going from manager from individual contributor to manager or from manager to senior manager, manager, senior manager to director.
It's like going, it's like finishing university and then going to get a job. Like you've got all of these skills and you know the textbooks, you pass the tests. But when you go and get a job, it's completely different than what you learn.
And the principles are the same. The basic foundation of what you've learned is the same. However, you've now got to apply it in a very different way. And so I go on about communication a lot because it's a fundamental skill of management. Whether it's to your team, whether it's to your manager, whether it's to customers, clients, you know, you're constantly in communication. And communication, as we know, isn't just verbal. There's, you know, energetic feelings, there's body language, there's the way that you move, there's know the actions that you do with your hands, all of these things or, you know, any action that you do. And so I do think that communication is such a big part of managing up and learning how to do it takes time.
[00:23:14] Speaker B: So I agree with you 100%. And I think that, you know, if you're having, you're trying to deal with that or trying to learn, I don't think you should be frustrated with it because like you said, it takes time. So you're gonna get better at it as time goes. But it's if you stop doing it all together because you, you're like, I'm not good at this or what have you, then that's when I think you're going to run into trouble. But as long as you're improving every day, like I know as a leader we always say like that, I always say the minute that we decide that we know it all, that's when we're gonna run into trouble. So you have to continuously learn. We have to continuously get better. You know, as an HR person, like things are ever changing.
Things are going to change tomorrow, change next week in 2025. We're going to be going into a new year. I can't believe it. And we're halfway through 2024. But we're going to be, there's going to be something new. There's gonna be new things that we, that we're going to learn in 2025 or there's going to be a new phase or a new teachings or what have you. So if we're stopping learning, then we're hoodwinked. So yes, communicating, practicing, communicating is definitely key for sure.
[00:24:32] Speaker A: And I've noticed that a lot of the skills when it comes to managing up as part of my one on one coaching program, a lot of the skills that I'm teaching people or coaching them through are skills that they use in their private life as well. This isn't just about, you know, dealing with people or characters, bosses, peers, employees at work. This is about how they are communicating potentially with Partners, friends, family, acquaintances, people in the street, like, you know, the coffee barista, etc. Like, it's all about the way in which you are communicating. Because once you start being more conscious about the way that you communicate, you're more aware of its potential impact.
Right. And from a manager's perspective, that consciousness around communication can keep you out of trouble in so many ways. And in HR you see a lot, and sometimes flippant comments without a thought can cause a lot of damage.
And the response rate to conscious thought or conscious communication has a huge impact on the engagement of a company, of a team, of a group of people.
[00:25:50] Speaker B: And I imagine you're, you're dealing with a lot of your clients of, when it comes to communicating, that we are communicating, but we're understanding the importance of the listening as well. We're communicating, but we're also listening when to listen and when to give feedback. Right. So I think that's super important too, to understand that, you know, we, you know, we're communicating, we need to communicate, but we can't communicate over somebody else's thoughts or.
[00:26:22] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:26:23] Speaker B: Or thinking.
[00:26:24] Speaker A: And I, and part of one of the struggles I find with a lot of managers that move into the role is that they go into problem solving mode. And you know, a lot of managers have curated and created their career as an individual contributor. And they've spent, you know, sometimes upwards, 10, 15 years before they go into management just focusing on themselves, developing themselves into this, you know, unique, high performing individual. And then all of a sudden everything that they've worked towards for that, those 10, 15 years is now not necessarily directly applicable to their new role. So then they become a student again. Then they become, you know, that they're at the beginning of their degree again, they're not at the finish point of their degree. And we all know what it feels like to be a beginner. It's stressful, especially the older you get, because we associate age with capability when actually it's not. Like it's, it's not always the case. That's wrong. Like it's not always the case. And so when you start something new, you're a beginner again. And that transition into management, you do become a beginner again. And not even to mention, like if the role hasn't been appropriately described or the goals of the role haven't been accurately laid out, or you don't have a support network around you, it can feel heavy. It can feel heavy. And then we have, you know, the imposter syndrome that comes in like I Shouldn't be here. I shouldn't be doing this role. I'm not very good at this. And we all know where that goes with you know how that impacts our confidence and then on and on and on the cycle goes. And so I would say that there's a lot in it for managers to really start to invest in trainings and learning and coaching on how to get really good at managing up and communicating really effectively because it can really change the way that they feel about their role.
[00:28:23] Speaker B: You said, just said some good things there. I want to know from what you've seen, from what your teachings and from what you're the clients that you're working with, what will be the future of managing up or how do you see it looking in the future in terms of managing up?
[00:28:42] Speaker A: Really great question. I would say that the future of managing up that it will become more mainstream in internal coaching and management programs. I think it is there now, but there's. There will likely be more of an eye on it rather than it just being like a phase of learning. I think there'll be a lot of focus on it in future because ultimately better managing out calls for improved methods, approaches of communicating in order to understand others. So I do feel that it's going to become more of a topic of learning and development programs, but called different things. I don't know if the word managing up is going to be. Continue to be appropriate. I think it could be communicating with your boss or communicating with your peers, communicating with your team because it's what it calls for is that if everybody took a bit more of a step to move towards a bit more of a coaching style leadership rather than like the former execution only style leadership.
I do feel naturally it will become a larger portion of learning and development programs in future for managers.
[00:30:04] Speaker B: So when you say you think it's going to become more mainstream, are you thinking that organizations, because we talked about this earlier, organizations and individual contributors who become managers are going to feel that they need to take the onus on themselves and the responsibility to make sure that they are better managers and leaders.
[00:30:27] Speaker A: Yeah, I think the. I think the onus is already there. I genuinely don't think people turn up to work and want to do a bad job. And I know some people will have experiences with people that they feel haven't necessarily done a good job. But I don't feel that people turn up to work and want to sabotage other people. I think it's usually there is a reason for that behavior, whether it's fear driven, whether it's you know, scarcity mindset versus, like, abundant opportunities to learn. Whether it's just like, lack of training, I do feel like it will become more mainstream because it will. It will become more of a requirement as part of a new leadership style that I'm seeing trending through. And that is being discussed when it comes to being more empathetic. And empathy isn't just about, you know, not holding anybody accountable. It's. It's not that at all. It's really about truly understanding this person as an individual and being able to sit with them through something, not figure it out for them. That's a very different process, but to endure something without taking on the responsibility of it.
And that's what managers can sometimes really struggle with because there is more of a consciousness in business these days, like, people aren't staying in companies that they're no longer happy. And people aren't staying in companies where they don't feel like they're personally developing or whether they feel they are treated well or getting the support that they need. You know, people aren't staying just for a paycheck.
And that's not everybody. Everybody has different needs, but less and less people are just staying for a paycheck. I've seen many, many people over the course of my career leave for maybe less money, but a different environment that's just more suitable for them. And so I do feel like it will be something that is becoming more conscious.
[00:32:26] Speaker B: I just smiled when you said that people will leave because, you know, when we're talking about, when you're saying that you think it's going to be more mainstream and more of a requirement. I feel it's because of people that are coming into organizations, whether they're a candidate, whether they're interviewing, whether they get hired, they're demanding more and looking for more and not just for the paycheck, like you said, but they're wanting to have more of. I call it a safe work environment. And that's what everybody's looking for. And when they find that, then they'll stick around. So. And they're. Because they're going to feel comfortable. They're going to enjoy going to work every day. So like I said, when you said that, I just. It just put a smile on my face because I do agree with you 100%. I feel like it is going to be a requirement to manage up.
[00:33:22] Speaker A: Yeah. And, you know, I don't think people are going to enjoy 100% of what they do every day. Like, if you can get to like 80, 75, 80% of like. Yeah, I really, I really enjoy what they do. Like there are parts of everybody's life that you don't feel like you want to do, but you have to do it. And it was. That it was the choice you made and all of that stuff. But yeah, I definitely feel like there is a need for better communication because the world is more aware of it now.
[00:33:52] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think it's different for everybody. I mean. Yeah, I mean, you know, I mean, you talk about personal life. I mean, people laugh at me because I tell them I love to. I mean, I love to fold laundry. It's very relaxing for me. I can put a basket in front of me and I can fold while I'm watching something on TV or a movie. But some people like, oh my God, I can't. I've told so many people that and they're like, oh my God, I can't believe that you like to do that. So yeah, I do agree with you. There's some things that people like to do at work that others hate and this is vice versa. So it's just. Yeah, I agree. It's just an, it's an individual thing for.
[00:34:25] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:34:26] Speaker B: So Laura, how do you think your hometown or city you grew up in molded you into the person that you are today?
[00:34:36] Speaker A: Oh, wow.
Another quite surprise question.
Or how did my hometown mold me or city? I would say there was two phases or three phases. My, where I was born, that was an area that was really fun. I had a lot of. I was still in the era where we played outside, like 90s child, so still played outside. I lived in a cul de sac and we were very, very friendly with all of our neighbors. We were all kind of similar age, maybe like a five year age span between us all.
And I think that really gave me a lot of emphasis on the way in which I enjoy life. Like it was very much in the moment. We didn't have phones and you know, I used to fight with my sister about who was on the dial up Internet.
And so I think that that gave me the opportunity to be really present and it's something that I take really seriously now.
Then there was a period of my life where I was out of home. I moved out pretty early on in my life.
And that particular phase really taught me a work ethic. It was a hard job. I was working at a horse riding stables full time. It was like 5am to 8pm every day.
It was a lot of work, but it really taught me work ethic. And working really hard towards what I wanted. My dream was to become a top dressage rider. And so, but it taught me a lot. I was coaching, I was being coached very well and so. And then there was another area of my life where I was living in London in the uk and that really taught me about career and focusing on work, but also building a life not necessarily around work, but with work.
And it was a busy time. If anybody's been to London, you'll understand like London takes over your life. And I think it really taught me that. I love city life, but I'm definitely a country bumpkin at heart.
And so when I moved to Canada, that's the fourth phase of my life was really an opportunity to set my life up to how I really want it in future.
Which is a really good balance between living more of a country style life but also having access to a city for things like this and meeting new people, getting really inspired by the busyness of a city and what it has to offer, like being such a tech hub.
So yeah, I would say it's molded me a lot in terms of keeping me present, giving me work ethic and then balancing, balancing life and work.
[00:37:37] Speaker B: It's super interesting, Laura. And you know, a lot of your story is a lot like mine. So we are very similar in, in very, in so many different ways.
I did play outside too when I was at, when I was younger. I was always outside in the summertime. I'd spend my days at the pool and then after supper I go home, have supper and I go back to the pool and then I go home, change and then I was outside. But I had a lot of parent leaders around wherever I was. There was always a lot of, like a lot of, I called them parent leaders because there was always a parent who was always leading us kids. So either we're, you know, going into the house or we were told, you know, oh, you should probably head home because, you know, your parent is put, you know, your parents are probably wondering where you are. So there was always somebody out there looking after you or making sure that you were. There was no problem or they had, each parent had their number. So if they, you know, they could call always so and so there, yeah, can you tell them to head home and you know, that type of stuff. So it was pretty cool to have that. And there was a lot of security I found when I was a kid. I had a lot of sense of security. I had a lot of, I call them still to this day. Moms who fed me like I probably sometimes had like two, three suppers sometimes because I would go and eat at home and then I'd eat there or they'd say, are you hungry? We have this or whatever. So it was just so nice to have that. And so I love that. And then the career, you know, the, the moving out that you said, we taught, we're taught worth it work ethic and your, your career and the love of the city. I grew up in a big city in, in the eastern part of Canada and it was a big city and so I grew up in that and I'm in a little bit of a smaller city now. So it's just different way of life.
But back then it's more hustle and bustle here it's a little bit more laid back, more we'll, you know, we'll get it done, no problem, that type of thing. So, yeah, super interesting.
[00:39:43] Speaker A: Yeah, lots of synergy there.
[00:39:45] Speaker B: It sure is. Sure is. Well, listen, this has been such a great conversation, Laura. I've truly enjoyed it. Any final thoughts today for our listeners?
[00:39:57] Speaker A: I would just say that the managers listening, it takes time to, to learn different ways of communicating and every opportunity that you have to communicate, just absorb it. And I would say that the conversations that you struggle with are your biggest opportunities to learn. So for the uncomfortableness or the uncomfortability that you get from the situation, the more uncomfortable it is, the more you're going to learn from it. So if I can offer that mindset shift of, you know, do do the things that make you uncomfortable because it's going to, it's going to have the biggest return on the investment. If we always continue to do what we're always good at, you know, you're not going to grow. And so if you're feeling a bit like you have some imposter syndrome, reframe that. To say like I'm about to level up and it is a bit scary. Change development is a bit scary because it's the unknown. But if it feels a bit uncomfortable, then what, what is it that's uncomfortable and what are you going to learn from it if you keep going?
[00:41:05] Speaker B: I love everything that you packed in there, Laura. I just wanna, I want to take the time to thank you for coming on today. You are an amazing individual. You're such a gem. You're such a gem to talk to. You're such a gem to communicate with. I love when you talk about communicating because you are a sensational communicator and I just love the passion that you have for what you do, and that's what caught my attention to you and that's why I wanted to have you on is because I just admire and I just adore your passion. And I. My advice to you is continue that. Don't ever let that go because that is something that truly makes you a remarkable individual is your passion.
[00:41:48] Speaker A: Oh, thank you so much. Oh, yeah. Oh, I'm all embarrassed, but thank you so much. I really appreciate it. I love talking about this stuff. I can talk about it for hours. I do feel really passionate about it because I just. I have seen people struggle with it so much. And I too have struggled with communication in the past, like not always being able to communicate what I'm thinking or really want to say or hiding it in a way. And if I can empower other people through my experience and I absolutely want to do that, I think that's part the one of the main reasons why I chose to. To serve others in the way that I'm doing it. So thank you for allowing me the space to use my voice and share with others. I'm really grateful for you.
[00:42:36] Speaker B: I. I absolutely love that. On behalf of myself and my guest Laura, I would like to thank you all for listening today. Until next time, be safe. And remember, everybody, that if we all work together, we can accomplish. Anyway, you have been listening to let's be Diverse with Andrew Stout.
[00:42:57] Speaker A: To stay up to date with future content, hit Subscribe.
