Leading With Impact

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Opinions expressed in this episode are personal. They do not necessarily reflect the views of this streaming platform. [00:00:14] Speaker B: Good day, everyone, and welcome to another edition of let's be diverse. I am your host, Andrew Stout. This episode is dedicated to all my loved ones who have supported me through this journey. One of my most favorite topics that I love to discuss is leadership. I can talk all day long on topics on leadership, so I thought today would be a great time to be talking about leading with impact. And my guest today that I'm so happy to have on is Amy Michaels. Now, Amy Michaels is a seasoned HR consultant and the founder of Wolfpack HR, a consulting firm specializing in solutions for small businesses and startups. She has an MBA in human resources management and is also a certified mediator and facilitator. Additionally, as a founding member of Wynn Women's Impact Network, Amy is committed to helping other female entrepreneurs and business owners achieve their goals. She is based in the scenic black hills of South Dakota and balances her professional life with her family time and adventures with her wineraminers. I'm not sure how to pronounce that, but I met Amy on LinkedIn a while back. We had such a great conversation. It was one of those conversations where I felt like I could speak with her. We spoke for about an hour, but I felt like it could probably go longer. Almost all day to that matter. That's how well it went. But of course, we both have professional lives, so we had to cut it short. But she's a phenomenal individual, and I'm so happy to have her on. Welcome to the show, Amy. I am so humbled and honored to have you on today. [00:01:57] Speaker C: Thank you so much. Same here. I'm also humbled and honored to be part of your podcast. And the dogs that I have are called weimaraners. I know. It's a tongue twister. They are a crazy breed. [00:02:09] Speaker B: Yeah. And how many dogs do you have? [00:02:12] Speaker C: I have two. [00:02:13] Speaker B: Oh, nice. I am a pet owner myself. I have a Boston terrier, cross with a pug. So she's a bug. Yeah. So she's a tiny little thing, but, boy, she. You think that she's bigger than she is sometimes, yeah. [00:02:30] Speaker C: They have huge personalities. Before we had Weimaraners, we had Boston terriers. Oh, yes. [00:02:36] Speaker B: She's full of energy. She's cute, and she knows it. Amy. So that's the story there. So, Amy, how are things with you? What's new in your world? What's exciting? Tell us all what's going on. [00:02:49] Speaker C: Yeah, there's a lot of exciting things happening as we enter 2024 here in a new year. Right now, the biggest thing that I'm working on is a summit with twelve other professionals that are service based individuals who have a heart for supporting small businesses and startups as well. So we are in the process of getting that wrapped up and it will be going live here within the next week. I have just a lot of things on my bucket for the year here in 2024 tied to my business and the Women's Impact Network, both just trying to grow and expand those areas. [00:03:32] Speaker B: Wonderful. So it sounds like you got your hands in all different buckets of stuff. So that's awesome. That really is. And for people who can't see, Amy is super passionate about what she does. And I could definitely see it in her face and her smile and I can hear it in her voice as well, how passionate she is about all the things that she does. When you're passionate about what you do, it's so fun to organize these things and get fully involved and get your feet wet into it. I love it. I'm glad to hear that things are going so well with you. Before we begin, as we discussed before we started taping today, I always have a fun question to ask my guests to get things going. Are you ready for yours today, Amy? [00:04:18] Speaker C: Yes, you're right on me. [00:04:20] Speaker B: All right, so my question for you is, if eating your dessert before a meal will spoil your appetite, then why won't eating a meal before your dessert ruin your appetite for dessert? [00:04:35] Speaker A: That's a good question. [00:04:36] Speaker C: It's because dessert is about the sweetest things, and dessert is the sweetest things in life. And once you're able to have the sweetest thing that you desire, then you don't have an appetite for anything else. Whereas if you're eating your meal first and then have dessert, you still have that lingering desire for the sweetest thing. That's my theory on why. If you eat dessert first, it ruins your appetite for your regular meal. But if you have your regular meal first, then you still have room for dessert because you haven't had the sweetest thing in life yet. [00:05:15] Speaker B: Wow. You know what? When I put this question together, I did not expect that answer. So I am so impressed with your answer, not knowing what was coming a little bit about you, your story, and your why. [00:05:31] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. Like you had introduced, I live in South Dakota. I was born and raised, and I have been in human resources for a number of years now. And based on the conversation that we're going to be having later, I'll dive into that a little bit deeper, but I really enjoy what I do. I like it a lot. I was in the corporate world for a number of years before I moved into consulting and have been working with small businesses and startups for a number of years now. But I saw that there was a gap in the market when it comes to small businesses and startups. And after being in the traditional consulting world, in recognizing that gap, I decided to take the leap and start wolfpack HR so I could support small businesses and start startups in that area in a more effective and affordable manner. Most of the time, small businesses don't pursue consulting help because there is a very high price tag involved. It's not really something that is typically affordable to small businesses and it's not accessible or something that they can really budget for. Because typically when they need consulting services, it's because they have a big problem that needs to be solved or they've been hit with something like a fine, or they're in trouble with the government in some way and they need a consultant to come in to clean things up and help them out. And you don't always know how long that's going to take. So sometimes they're hit with a very large consulting bill that they were not prepared for. So what I do is more fractional HR services where I come in and I help small businesses and I help startups in those scenarios where they're not large enough to have somebody come in full time and hire somebody in house full time, I'd help bridge the gap so they can receive the services that they truly need just on a part time basis. And I do it at a flat rate pricing service so it is more affordable, accessible and scalable for them as well. [00:07:43] Speaker B: So much to pack in there. So first off, I've heard so much about South Dakota, so I want to definitely go out there and visit at some point. As far as the small business startup, I definitely agree with you. I feel like not only do companies not want to work with a consultant because they think it's so high, a lot of business owners feel, which is I see even leaders feel like they know everything about the business. And as a leader, how I think of things is you don't know everything. And as soon as you think you know everything, that's when you get yourself in trouble. So I call myself a lifelong learner. I'm always learning, I'm always listening to people. I'm always taking people's advice. I'm always reading what people have to say and I think it's important to do that. So I commend you for taking the chance to go in to these companies and do this, knowing that right off the bat, they're probably not wanting to hear what you have to say or not wanting to pursue any business with you, and when in fact, law cases it might be needed. [00:08:51] Speaker C: Yes, yes. Yeah. In those scenarios, even if they haven't maybe made a mistake and like their employment processes, and maybe they're not in any sort of trouble with the government around that, maybe they just have some team dynamic issues. And you may know everything about your business and how to run it and how it functions, but you may not be equipped to handle some of those team dynamic issues or employee relations problems that might arise. So that's another thing that I'm able to bring to them at a more affordable and accessible rate. [00:09:29] Speaker B: I love that. And the fact, too, that, like I was saying earlier, that leaders don't know everything and they should ask for help, especially if it comes to marketing and stuff like that, but also too, dealing with employees and understanding the differences in different employees and how one works, how you had motivated one differently than the other. And like you said, legal issues, that type of stuff, I could definitely see where your company would fit in for sure. [00:09:58] Speaker C: Yeah, I hope so. [00:09:59] Speaker B: Anyway, so what I wanted to know was, what does leading with impact mean to you? Amy? [00:10:06] Speaker C: Yeah, leading with impact. To me, kind of multifaceted. It's a concept that I've come to appreciate deeply through my journey as an entrepreneur and a founder. But even before that, because HR is very complex. Complex and very broad. It has a hand in every area of business. So when I stepped into the entrepreneurial world and established Wolfpack, my vision was to create a consulting firm that not only supported small businesses and startups, but also embodied the essence of impactful leadership. In my experience, impactful leadership is about creating environment, or environments where every team member feels empowered and valued, leading by example and fostering a culture of mutual respect, collaboration and innovation is really necessary. And so at Wolfpack HR, we specialize in helping organizations build those cultures and focus on the human aspects of business, which often gets overlooked in the rush of operational tasks. That's the entrepreneurial side of what leading with impact means to me. But I also, like you had mentioned in one of the founding members of WIM, the Women's Impact Network. And that's just reinforced my belief in the power of community and support networks in order to amplify impact. And being a founding member of this organization has really helped female entrepreneurs and business owners in their mission driven ventures. It's been really enlightening, and it also underscores the importance of leading with a purpose that goes beyond the bottom line, because everybody can make money to a certain extent. But if you're not leading with that vision to make a more meaningful difference in the world, it's going to be hard to get people on board to help support that vision. And so if your bottom line is just about money, I don't think you're going to be able to make much of an impact. One of the things that we have done at Wolfpack HR is to really incorporate the business around a deeper social mission. Making a huge difference for small businesses and startups is our passion, but we also understand that we're all here living on the same planet at the same time, and we rely on the planet to be able to survive. So one of the initiatives that we have tied our business efforts to with Wolfpack is supporting initiatives that are going to make that bigger impact on our environment. So we really put an emphasis on being able to protect and preserve the environment as part of what we do in our business. [00:13:01] Speaker B: So much to pack in there. First of all, I love when you said the power of community. I was having a conversation with somebody just today, and we were talking about how, like you said, businesses are. It's fine that you want to make money, and that's perfectly fine. But people have forgotten the fact that building rapport and building a community which will build your brand, we're in the fact where that you are going to be in a room, where there's going to be a room of two or three different people and they're going to be talking about you and you're not even in the room. And that is so impactful that we're talking about money. I think that is the most important thing, because that is what's gonna drive your business by people talking about you all the time. It's free advertising, so you want to build that community. It's super important. The other thing is the human aspect. I just talked about it before. Figuring out your team, getting to know your team, and figuring out what motivates each individual, the thing that might motivate you, Amy, is not the same things that maybe might motivate me. And it's the job of a leader to figure those things out. And I think also, too, you said leading with purpose. It's almost like the game, follow the leader, right? When you're a kid, you played follow the leader and you follow what the leader was doing the same thing in business. If the leader is not handling chaos 100% or they can't hack it and they're all over the place, then your employees are going to be all over the place. If you are a calm, cool, collective leader, then your team is going to follow that because they're going to see, wow, it's so nutty around here right now, and they are so calm. I want to be like them. So just those things just. I lit up as you were saying all those things, and I just love everything that you said there. [00:15:08] Speaker C: Awesome. Yeah. The community has made a difference for myself moving into business. Part of why I named the company wolfpack HR is when I first started, I was by myself. I was a lone wolf trying to navigate starting a business on my own. And I realized myself that I need a pack that I can rely on. And things didn't really start to shift for me until I started building my own pack and developed my own community of like minded professionals that have been through it before and people that were serving a similar audience, they had a heart to serve small business owners and help them in other avenues of business that they needed help in. And so there's definitely a huge power in impact that can come out of community. [00:16:07] Speaker B: Absolutely. So I know we talked about it, but I want to delve into it a little bit further here because I think it's really important. How do we help a leader determine the best way to lead with impact? [00:16:19] Speaker C: Yeah. So when I've been working with leaders to help them determine what their broader business goals and objectives are, in order to understand how I could then help them lead with impact, it's really, that's the starting point. It's really crucial to understand the broader impact that they're wanting to make within their company and with their company's goals, because they're not always accomplished just by the business owner or the business leaders, you do rely on your team. So once we understand what those overarching objectives are and we're clear, then we're able to dive into understanding where the individual leaders of the company, where their strengths are, and how we can harness those and then take that further to effectively form communication with the team to be able to communicate that bigger vision that they have to to move that impact forward. If your team doesn't understand what the vision is or why you have that vision, then it's really hard to be able to even communicate that to your team to get to the next level. I would say the concept of start with why Simon Sinek's philosophy is where you need to start to be able to help leaders, then communicate the impact that they're wanting to make with their teams and then understanding their team's strengths and weaknesses and align that with where you'll be able to make the most impact in your company. [00:18:03] Speaker B: I love all that. So what I'm thinking, what you said there is understanding a broader picture. What I'm thinking, too, is that a lot of leaders, they don't understand broader picture. But if you ask them questions about the vision of the company, a lot of leaders don't know what the vision is of the company or they're put into a leadership role that they're not ready to be in. So they're not able to explain that. So I definitely agree with you, communication, and I definitely think some training and development to help them understand division and also not only understand it, you can understand it, but you need to be able to explain it to individuals as well. If you don't know how to explain it, then they're not going to understand it. So that's that communication factor. With the understanding factor, two are very important. [00:18:58] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:18:59] Speaker B: Do you think that managers focus solely on the task execution rather than building rapport and communication with their teams? [00:19:07] Speaker C: I think based on the leaders that I've worked with throughout my career, I believe many of them are under the impression that they are focusing on building rapport and communication with their teams. And I think they have good intentions. But there is that struggle there in really understanding a strong team dynamic and their role in effective communication. A lot of times the leaders themselves are put under constraints to provide results. And so I know that a lot of times it comes top down. And so even though they might have the best intentions and they think they might have built a rapport with their team, ultimately it always ends up coming back to that task execution because they want to receive the visible outcomes. So I think if there seems like there's maybe a breakdown, they need to go back to really focusing on what does it take to build that team rapport in order to execute effectively on that task orientation and how that all aligns with the bigger objectives that they are trying to accomplish. [00:20:26] Speaker B: I totally agree with you. I think that when we talk about intentions or even constraints when you're a leader, I think the main thing for you is to help people appreciate their position and plan for growth. So I believe that you're doing that by building rapport and communicating that because you don't know what somebody wants. There can be people who want to grow into a leadership role. And there are people who are okay being a data entry person and entering the stuff starting at eight, leaving at five, and going home to spend time with their families. No extra company phone, no laptop to take home. They're okay with that. The communication factor is you talked about good intentions, figuring out the intentions of your employees and your teams, which ones want to grow, which ones are looking to grow, and which ones understand what it means when you are growing into a leader. Not just saying I'm a leader, but understanding what leadership means, I think is super important. [00:21:39] Speaker C: Yeah, that's very true, because not everybody who is in a leadership role recognizes that there are individuals on a team that may not have a growth focus and their area of genius in their life probably is a passion outside of the workplace. And having those conversations, to be able to align with your team, to be able to support them the best, so they can then turn around and support you the best, is definitely something that needs to happen in every organization. [00:22:16] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. You can't help somebody if you don't know what they're looking for. You can't help them if you don't know. Totally true. So what advice would you give an organization that is struggling with leading with impact? [00:22:30] Speaker C: Yeah, I would say typically when organizations are struggling to accomplish their larger goals or objectives, they tend to start seeking outside or external assistance from like a consultant, like myself. So in my role, I recognize that there are a number of factors to consider when addressing challenges. And so if there's a company that is struggling to lead with impact, given the complexity of organizational dynamics, my response to that question will have to be somewhat broad. Not having specifics, but my experience in keeping in line with the conversation we've had to this point, I would say the root of most of the problems I've encountered in organizations can be traced back to a breakdown in communication. So I would say the first step for any organization that is looking to improve their leadership impact is to conduct an evaluation of their communication processes. And it should be from the top down and the bottom up to see where maybe where the gaps might lie or where there might be that breakdown in communication as a first step. And then from there, they, like I said, it's a complex thing that isn't going to be answered with a cut and dry answer. But any emphasis that they can put on effective communication is a good point to start at to evaluate where they can improve their leadership efforts in being able to make an impact. [00:24:09] Speaker B: I totally agree with you. I talked to a lot of people. And I agree with the communication factor, either a lack of communication or there's been situations or what I've heard where there wasn't the proper things communicated to the employees. So they weren't getting the right information right from the get go. So I think it's understanding what information that you're trying to give doing out and making sure that it's communicated in a proper manner that you understand it and that your employees understand. And if you don't know how to communicate it, well, then try to get some help. And if you don't know the answer to something, then don't answer it willy nilly and say, this is what it is. When it's not, be honest and I'll say the word vulnerability. Have a little bit of vulnerability and say, listen, I don't know the answer to this. However, let me get that answer for you and I'll get back to you. But let's also remember that if we're going to tell somebody that we're going to get the information and get back to them, let's make sure that we get back to them, because if we don't get back to them, then it's just as bad. So if you don't know the answer two days later and you're still waiting, at least tell them. Amy, listen, I haven't gotten the information for the question he asked me. I haven't forgotten you. As soon as I find out or get that answer to you, I will get it to you. But I just wanted to let you know that I haven't forgotten you. I'm still working on it. So at least they know that. [00:25:48] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:49] Speaker B: It's being worked on or being looked after. [00:25:51] Speaker C: Yeah, I would say that not only in the workplace, just in life in general, the only constant is change. And the, some of the organizations that I have been part of in the past, there has definitely been that challenge to get out ahead of the communication. When a change is going to be happening, employees are very intuitive. If they see that there's something a little bit different, even in the way leadership is acting or maybe in the way certain things are being communicated, they're going to pick up on the fact that something might be happening. So I think the more effective organizations can be in being proactive in their communication when they know a big organizational change is coming, the better, because then it just eliminates all of the stories that employees are going to start telling themselves and telling each other about what potentially could be happening. [00:26:57] Speaker B: Absolutely. And it's all those closed doors. Amy, it's like when they see, like the closed door meetings and there's a lot more than regular, and then, okay, what's going on? But I still think that you might not be able to tell everything, but you could say, listen, we're having some discussions. Here's what I can tell you, and then tell them, so be honest. Telling them, this is what I can tell you. They ask questions and you can't answer. Just be honest. I can't answer that at this moment. However, I hope to be able to answer that question down the road. But at least if you're giving them something, give them instead of leaving them out in the dark, and then, like you said, telling stories or wondering, and then they're all jumping to conclusions. Yeah, exactly. In the lunchroom or at the coffee machine, what's going on? And I saw that they were all in a closed door meeting yesterday. And this warning, it's very important. [00:27:57] Speaker C: And I think even more in this post COVID world that we're living in, where a lot of organizations have decided to stay fully remote or maybe adopt a hybrid model. Even more emphasis needs to be put on communication because not everybody's going to be in the office face to face. And so you need to take into consideration where your company is at, what kind of model you're operating under, and form your communications around that. If you're operating fully remote or even in a hybrid environment, you're going to have to alter how you communicate with your employees and make sure that the message is being understood, because it's not easy to communicate through email and text all the time. [00:28:47] Speaker B: For sure. Amy, how do you think your hometown of South Dakota shaped you into the person that you are today? [00:28:57] Speaker C: I would say growing up in the Midwest has probably had a profound influence on shaping me as the person I am today. The Midwest is renowned for really strong work that. And so this is something that was definitely instilled in me at a very young age. And growing up in a community where we had to work hard and we were dedicated, we also felt that we were highly valued. And I learned the importance of putting effort in to achieve my goals. I was involved in four h growing up, and I think that played a significant role in me developing my leadership skills. Skills. I'm not sure if everybody is familiar with four h, and I don't know if it's in Canada or if it's just in the US, but four h is based on a foundation of head, heart, hands and health. And I think that really carries over into HR. It's probably why I chose it as a career for myself, because HR is the head, heart, hands, and health of an organization. The responsibilities that the department carries really helps employees and businesses thrive in the work environment. So my midwest upbringing and my early experiences in four h, I think, have been extremely fundamental in shaping my personal values, my work ethic, and also my professional career path. [00:30:25] Speaker B: I love the four h philosophy because I feel like today, I feel like most people want to be seen, heard, valued, and understood. So that just makes me think of that. And you're absolutely right. HR, head, heart, hands, and health is pretty much what HR is all about. A lot of people who are not in HR, who have never been in HR, probably don't understand that, and in some cases, don't believe that. But in reality, that's exactly what HR is all about. And I totally love the fact that where you grew up, you learned. Love that the four h process. And I think that's amazing that it instilled that in you a young age. You're still young in my mind, Amy, but at a young age, it taught you all these important values that you've brought to the table. And I was talking to somebody the other day, and a lot of people, when they go to school, they study something, and then they do that career. And then some people decided they want to change, but they don't think that they can change because they don't have the schooling. But from what you just said there, you can actually take pieces of what you've learned from a career and take it to another career and move forward. So, for example, you could be a teacher and take the things that you've learned in teaching to go to, let's say, recruiting, because there's things as a teacher that you value, and you learn that you could take to become someone in HR or in recruitment, like I said. So it's amazing that you learned that. The four h's. I'm gonna have to steal that one. I think that's pretty cool. [00:32:13] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it's more, not so much the actual skills of a particular position. It's more the foundational skills that people learn in life that are the transferable skills. So that comes down to, again, communication. What kind of communication skills did you learn in this job that you can take into the next job? What skills did you learn around leadership or processes? Yeah, I think it's very much the core and foundational skills that people learn that they can then take into another career. And very few people stay in one career or one job their whole life. And I think the people that are able to explore and experience multiple different career paths are more well rounded employees because they've been able to bring a broader experience to their next role. [00:33:12] Speaker B: I talked to an HR person years ago. She's an HR manager, and she told me when she's interviewing people, she says, I'm not talking about director or higher management positions, but she said, if I'm looking for somebody, I'll look at the hard and soft skills of the individual. And she says, I will take somebody who has soft skills and will be a great fit, and I can train them, rather than somebody who has the skills as far as knowledge, skills, and abilities in the end. But they don't have the soft skills, so they don't have the integrity of that authenticity. They're not loyal, that type of stuff, because you can train somebody to do the job, but you can't train them, in some cases on personality. And is that personality gonna fit in the organization and with the team? [00:34:09] Speaker C: So I second, 100% agree with her. [00:34:12] Speaker B: Yeah. When she told me that, I thought, wow, that's pretty cool. That when. And not again, not a lot of people think that. They look at. [00:34:20] Speaker C: They look at the resume. Yep. [00:34:23] Speaker B: They see, oh, I need this. I never went to school for that, so I don't have that. But they don't actually look at the, like you said, transferable skills that they possess. Oh, I could. Oh, I've done that before. I've done that before. I'm a good communicator. I'm proficient in this. Proficient in that. I don't limit one. I throw my name in the hat and see what happens. Any final thoughts today? [00:34:44] Speaker C: Yeah, I just. As we're entering into a new year, I want everybody to reach for the biggest impact that they can make in 2024, whether that be in their personal life, in their professional life, if they're stepping into a new career or starting a business, especially if you're a female starting a business, feel free to reach out to us at Wynn, the women's Impact Network, where you can have a built in community of women helping you. But I think we're all here to do something bigger and greater in life, and I believe that means we're all called to make a bigger impact. [00:35:24] Speaker B: I love all that. To reach for your biggest impact. I love that. Amy, I want to take the time to thank you for coming on today. Like I mentioned at beginning of our podcast today, I had one conversation with you over the phone. It was an impactful conversation. I've honestly felt like I could probably talk to you for another two 3 hours because it just flowed so nicely. [00:35:51] Speaker C: I appreciate that so much and I thank you for having this podcast and doing your part in the world to make a bigger impact. I know that your podcast reaches a lot of people and makes a difference in their daily lives as well. I love listening to all the previous episodes and I look forward to listening to your future episodes as well. [00:36:13] Speaker B: Amy, I could definitely tell you that. And I could tell our guests this will definitely not be the last time that we have a discussion with you on this podcast. I definitely have the intentions of bringing you back at some point in 2024 time or down the road, but you're definitely in my peripheral vision to have back on for sure. It was a pleasure again to have you on today. [00:36:39] Speaker C: Oh, I would love that. I would love that. Yes, anytime. Just give me a call. [00:36:44] Speaker B: I love it. I definitely will for sure. So on behalf of myself and my guest Amy, I would like to thank you all for listening today. And until next time, everybody be safe and remember that if we all work together, we can accomplish anyone. [00:37:04] Speaker A: You have been listening to. Let's be diverse with Andrew Stout. To stay up to date with future content, hit subscribe.